Curse

Pillie · Dec 10, 2006, 02:25 PM // 14:25

First of all, my apologies to the rest of the forum community. this is yet ANOTHER thread about the AI since the update. I have sent increasingly frustrated e-mails to guild wars support about this issue, and each time they have responded insisting that I make a new post on the fan forums in order to get my question answered (despite there already being several of them).

Now my question (copied from my first e-mail to support):

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Since the introduction of the new AI I have noticed a severe problem with monster behaviour. I often play a Mo/A with dash specifically so i can break monster agro when being chased if my party dies. Since the update I have been unable to do so and monsters either:
a) Chase me across the entire map without stopping until I am dead also
b) seem to go back to their original patrol, then when i return to the area, repeatedly chase me away, meaning i can never resurrect my team.

I have noticed this is a particular problem in the fissure of woe and the southern shiverpeaks (with avicara guile and grawl being the worst offenders).

I have seen numerous posts about this on various fan forums and cannot find any proper information on this issue. Can you please tell me if this is a bug (and if so, when you think it may be fixed) or an intentional feature (and if so, why?).

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Gaile/Dev team, if you have the time to look into this i would be very grateful,

Thanks a lot

Alya · Dec 10, 2006, 02:41 PM // 14:41

I second this question as well. Perma-lock and perma-aggro AI behaviour was introduced with the "AI fix" of October, 30 2006, and despite numerous pleas, we still haven't heard from Anet if this behaviour is intended, or they are going to fix it.

<-- increasingly frustrated

Big_Iron · Dec 10, 2006, 02:56 PM // 14:56

I'll third it. My whole party was wiped except for me while playing NF yesterday. I couldn't get anywhere near anyone to rez them because I would be chased away, even though the monsters were nowhere close to my aggro circle. As soon as I started to approach my fallen party, they'd charge after me. This isn't the first time either, just an example.

Cyan The Archer · Dec 10, 2006, 02:57 PM // 14:57

This isn't exactly AI, but they also need to fix the "spawn-killing" problem. When you res at a shrine you're likely to get attacked by a group patrolling near it. This is extremely frustrating because you will die lots of times before killing that group.

Navaros · Dec 10, 2006, 03:01 PM // 15:01

I would speculate that this is not a feature because I recall an old update where they changed FoW aggro behaviour so that the AI doesn't chase you so far across the map any more. It would be a major step backwards to now make it a "feature" to never be able to shake aggro anywhere.

This perma aggro happened to me a lot too. Most annoyingly on the Gate of Pain mission where I had a Terrorweb Dryder literally chase me halfway across the map, then I'd circle around and res a dead ally and repeat the cycle multiple times, then an Emissary got in on the action from time to time even though he was never re-aggroed during the flee cycle.

While we are on the subject of bugged aggro AI, I'm pretty sure Kormir also draws aggro like a gigantic magnet which is every bit or more annoying as any of the other problems listed in this thread seeing as Kormir cannot be controlled at all.

Definitely be good to have official word about this stuff.

Tydra · Dec 10, 2006, 04:01 PM // 16:01

/signed
i'd like to get an answer bout this issue finally too. i've been posting at other threads about my personal experiences with monster AI just like many other ppl did. i didn't see any responses from official side so far

lacasner · Dec 10, 2006, 04:04 PM // 16:04

Gaile made a thread about Anet devs answering some of our questions I remember, but I never got any answers lol...

*Darcy* · Dec 10, 2006, 04:10 PM // 16:10

And I would like to add that with the new AI, all skills that target adjacent, nearby etc foes are totally useless. With the mobs new spreadout and run, there are no adjacent or nearby foes.

Wheeler · Dec 10, 2006, 04:11 PM // 16:11

This happened to me last night also. As soon as I would get anywhere near my dead party members, they would re-agro. We had to start over because the 3 live people couldn't get near the dead ones. Soon as we would break agro we would wait til the mob had moved back to their original spot, take a few steps towards them and here they would come again. Also, if you die and rez and then try to slip by the the mob that you had agro'd they will re-agro from a mile away.

ericdanie · Dec 10, 2006, 04:22 PM // 16:22

Either make monsters break aggro and only re-estabilish aggro when the player enters their danger zone again or from now on call it the earshot bubble as it's only being accurate for working as an earshot range reference.

There are certain areas on the Domain of Anguish where if most of your party dies, you've lost. Monsters will NEVER break aggro and will chase you FOREVER, the only way to counter this is what I call the "aggro stretch" method, and will require at least 2 people alive able to communicate with each other.

A and B will run in opposite ways. Let's say the monsters are chasing A. So, after a while running, B stops and A continues running. There will be a point where monsters will lock B as a target, and start running after him. A can now stop, and will run back and forth, making the monsters keep switching targets, so they will reach none. This is harder with bigger distances and with more people, but will earn you enough time to ressurect your teammates if done properly.

The monsters that specifically don't break aggro so far I've met are the pop-ups on Stygian Veil, on the way to the second Underlord.
Any other monster that will not chase you forever will still re-estabilish aggroed behaviour if you get within a certain distance of dead people, no matter where the monster is, it will start coming for you.

Zehnchu · Dec 10, 2006, 04:41 PM // 16:41

This problem with the AI is older then most think. It’s been around since Factions came out. Huge treads with screen shots I think some one even posted a video. But I will say that the latest update to improve has made it more noticeable.

thelessa · Dec 10, 2006, 04:58 PM // 16:58

Before the update they would at least break arrgo most of the time, now is is almost to impossible to rez you team, since they are right back on you before you can even say rez, let alone do it.

Mostly I have noticed this in Nightfall, in the Torment areas, but even all thru the different chapters they will do it too.

Also the fact that you have run away and they can still hit you from a mile away, (red dots are at least 2 arrgo bubbles behind you), without being rubberbanded back into them, so I don't think that is lag.

I died last night in Sorrows Furnace with that happening, no one near, yet I was taking damage and died.

King Kong · Dec 10, 2006, 05:29 PM // 17:29

This will get fixed just before the next chapter, to show they do listen

Silly Warrior · Dec 10, 2006, 06:13 PM // 18:13

The AI is still not fixed (if its broken) and its incredibly annoying, and its not working how it said it should work in the manuel.

Its a known fact that a monster can't attack (see you) unless your little aggro bubble goes near him so he can....but somehow enemies are able to see you even when your VERY VERY far away from them...my question is why?

So I guess the question is: Is this horrible AI intended? If it is....wow.

Aera · Dec 10, 2006, 06:16 PM // 18:16

Can't really say it's broken. Wouldn't you be totally pissed off when a group of wankers just killed a few of your buddies? I'd chase 'em down to kill them as well.

Pillie · Dec 10, 2006, 06:41 PM // 18:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aera

Can't really say it's broken. Wouldn't you be totally pissed off when a group of wankers just killed a few of your buddies? I'd chase 'em down to kill them as well.

This may be true, but I think its taking realism a bit far. I play these games to enjoy myself. Having to redo 2 hours of fissure because one creature couldn't let go is not fun.

The Omniscient · Dec 10, 2006, 06:48 PM // 18:48

There was this annoying perm-agro when I was farming shak jarin's sword.

Alya · Dec 10, 2006, 07:01 PM // 19:01

Aera: the perma-lock AI behaviour was fixed months ago in one of the earlier updates (it was admitted that it was a BUG), and reinstated again in the AI fix of October, 30. Please do not drag here false realism analogies. Do not start discussions whether it's a likely behaviour of real life foes.

We only just want to get a clear answer from Anet to the questions mentioned in the first message of this thread.

icedragon981 · Dec 10, 2006, 07:26 PM // 19:26

Yes, I've had similar problems but one stands out more vividly in my mind. I was playing in a 4-man trapper group in UW (Used to do 55/SS but ever since the AI "update" well....you know) and our entire group, except for me, got wiped by the terrorwebs (trapped and killed all but one, the surviver went around the traps) and preceded to chase me, all the way back to the starting point where the lost soul is and all areas adjacent to it, it would not break aggro even though I was at least 2 or 3 radar ranges away from it's spawn point.

Illuminus · Dec 10, 2006, 08:08 PM // 20:08

This is also happening to me as well. My other team members start dying, so i decide to retreat and come back to resurrect them with my ritualist... but any attempt to come close to their bodies even if the monsters are not in range will cause them to chase you down, making it extremely difficult to actually resurrect someone without taking damage or dying yourself.